November 03, 2005

My Advice to the Gay Community

Don't worry about facts: lock and load!

Posted by Attila at November 3, 2005 01:50 PM | TrackBack
Comments

It's all part of the gay community's coordinated if curious strategy to follow the black community in walking the plank right off the political spectrum

Posted by: beautifulatrocities at November 3, 2005 03:56 PM


The difference being that the Dems use the black community as a source of votes, but regards gays/lesbians as a source of cash.

So it isn't like they can't tell the difference.

(Did you see the admission near the end of the article wherein it's fleetingly states that one of Alito's decisons had the effect of protecting a boy who was being gay-baited in a public school? No doubt Alito woke up on the wrong side of the bed that day.)

Posted by: Attila Girl at November 3, 2005 04:04 PM


Well, I'd say, given Alito's record, it is very likely that he would vote to overturn Lawrence v Texas. Lawrence being the most significant gay rights victory of the last, oh, 20 years, I'd say that gays have a reason to be a tiny bit concerned.

Posted by: Christophe at November 7, 2005 03:59 PM


And you base this prediction on . . . what?

Posted by: Attila Girl at November 7, 2005 06:30 PM


Let me ask a question first, and I'll promise to answer your original question:

Do the states, under the US Constitution as it exists at this moment, have the legal ability to outlaw specific sexual activities based on the activity or sex of the people performing it? (Setting aside Lawrence for the moment, of course.)

Posted by: Christophe at November 7, 2005 07:43 PM


No. I cannot see how one can justify any of the states prohibiting private consensual noncommercial behavior between adults.

I believe it's a unconstitutional overreach; I do not see how the State (or state) has a legitimate interest in this.

Posted by: Attila Girl at November 7, 2005 11:17 PM


OK. We agree. The question is, would the court?

Lawrence's dissenters were Scalia, Thomas, and Rehnquist. I have to observe that Alito is much more in their mould than in, say, Souter's. Scalia's dissent was particularly scathing (really, I used to admire Scalia, but he's becoming more than a bit cranky and irrational).

Of course, no one knows how Alito would vote on a case that relied on Lawrence as a precedent. If Alito is the kind of judge he appears to be, he might not even really know, since the case hasn't been presented yet. (Of course, my very own industry may give them the opportunity, in the form of Extreme Associates, since the US District Court in LA found that current obscenity law and Lawrence were incompatible. I'm not quite sure I see the reasoning, there, but I'm not a judge.)

Scalia, Thomas and Rehnquiest felt that, regardless of whether or not sodomy laws are good public policy, they are within the constitutional power of the state to enact. (Thomas, for example, pretty much said that he thought sodomy laws were bad public policy; from Scalia's dissent, in which he compared the laws against to sodomy to the laws against pederasty, I have to conclude he's more confortable with them.)

Alito strikes me as a judge who will be, if not a red-meat Orginalist, one who will view the doctrines that lead us from Griswold to Lawrence with plenty of suspicion.

As previously noted, I don't think Alito is a nut-case. I didn't think Rehnquist was a nut-case either (I have, ah, how shall we say, more nuanced opinions of Scalia and Thomas). But he does seem inclined to read the Constitution very narrowly, and a very narrow reading makes it hard to sustain Lawrence (or Griswold, or, yes, Roe, which is of course the ghost at this particular banquet).

Posted by: Christophe at November 8, 2005 08:35 AM


Of course, to overturn Lawrence, both Roberts and Alito would have to "vote" to do so. Another justice would have "flip." And then the very recent precedent of Lawrence would have to be overturned.

It sounds to me like a rather startling scenario.

Posted by: Attila Girl at November 8, 2005 10:40 AM


And then the very recent precedent of Lawrence would have to be overturned.

True, but Lawrence itself overturned a relatively recent precedent in the form of Bowers (as Scalia made sure everyone was quite aware). These things do happen.

Again, I'm not frothing at the mouth about Alito. The Supremes are, in fact, not nearly as important in the grand scheme of America as activists on either the right or the left make it out to be. And while O'Connor concurred on Lawrence, it was for different reasons than the rest of majority, so it's not entirely clear that the base votes have "changed."

But it's also not nuts to be concerned about Alito if you subscribe to the penumbra theory of rights.

Posted by: Christophe at November 8, 2005 11:01 AM


I'm still curious if you have specific cases of Alito's that lead you to believe he'd overturn Lawrence.

Posted by: Attila Girl at November 8, 2005 11:23 PM


No, but I don't think that's necessary to have concerns. It's a bit like asking a governor of a state, as a candidate for President, has a good track record in the conduct of a war. The Supreme Court is fundamentally different from every other court in the US, and the range of cases and the type of decisions are far different from that of any other court. Some surmise is always required, unless the judge just happened to be on the path of a hot button case; few are so cursed.

The only specifically gay-rights related case that he's voted on is Saxe, and that was a nuanced ruling that I happen to agree with (nose held, but I still have to agree with it). It had zero to do with the legal reasoning underlying Lawrence.

Remember, the question of Lawrence is not (setting aside what Scalia would clearly like it to be) "is sodomy a good thing the state shoudl promote?" but "is it within the state's power to restrict it?" (SoCons, I've noticed, do tend to confuse those two issues, assuming that everything allowed by the state must be perforce endorsed by it.) Alito has shown considerable deference to the legislature when it comes to gray areas, in the same line as Thomas and Scalia.

But we're not going to know for sure until the inevitable challenge to Lawrence reaches the court.

He has certainly not shown any particular friendless towards the rights of those accused of a crime. To me, that's a much bigger red flag, since if the US Constitution is about anything, it's about the rights of people who dissent from or are in trouble with the state.

Posted by: Christophe at November 9, 2005 10:04 AM


Clarence Thomas' dissent on the sodomy ruling was clear that were it up to him as a voter, he would vote against it. But that wasn't the question, only whether it violated the Constitution. States regulate all sorts of private behavior - they can tell you who you can have sex with (someone 18 but not 17), where, under the influence of what substances, whether you can pay someone for sex, etc.

The 'right to privacy' is a Humpty Dumpty right. (from Alice: "When I use a word, it means exactly what I want it to mean, nothing more, nothing less.") Somehow, it's never construed to mean you have the private right to own a gun, for instance.

As a homo myself, I have no problem with the legislature deciding such things, & that goes for abortion rights too. I don't agree with Prop 73, but a majority of Californians do. I'm far more concerned about runaway courts than runaway legislatures.

Posted by: beautifulatrocities at November 9, 2005 02:41 PM


One also has to remember that there are those of us who want the reasoning behind the decision to be sound, and actually think that's more important than the decision itself.

That is, rather than have a justice decide what the "good" outcome is, and then rationalize it, I want a constitutional scholar who will tell us what the law is, and work from there.

Then if the law sucks we can work on our Federal, local, and state legislators to change it.

Another way of saying it: I don't want someone who agrees with me. I want someone who's intellectually honest.

Posted by: Attila Girl at November 9, 2005 04:53 PM


I'm far more concerned about runaway courts than runaway legislatures.

So, what's your view on Bush v. Gore?

That is, rather than have a justice decide what the "good" outcome is, and then rationalize it, I want a constitutional scholar who will tell us what the law is, and work from there.

No problem. My disagreement with Alito (as I far as I can tell) is not about his politics, so to speak. I disagree with what I perceive as his interpretation of the Constitution, and feel that he will take too narrow an interpretation of the rights granted therein.

And let us not kid ourselves: Justices do work backwards from outcomes. Thomas does it. Scalia does it. I don't think that the platonic ideal of a completely results-free judge exists.

Posted by: Christophe at November 9, 2005 07:13 PM




Share photos on twitter with Twitpic "Let the issues be the issue.

About Joy W. McCann: I've been interviewed for Le Monde and mentioned on Fox News. I once did a segment for CNN on "Women and Guns," and this blog is periodically featured on the New York Times' blog list. My writing here has been quoted in California Lawyer. I've appeared on The Glenn and Helen Show. Oh—and Tammy Bruce once bought me breakfast.
My writing has appeared in
The Noise, Handguns, Sports Afield, The American Spectator, and (it's a long story) L.A. Parent. This is my main blog, though I'm also an alumnus of Dean's World, and I help out on the weekends at Right Wing News.
My political philosophy is quite simple: I'm a classical liberal. In our Orwellian times, that makes me a conservative, though one of a decidedly libertarian bent.


8843.jpg An American Carol rawks!
Main AAC site (Warning: sound-enabled;
trailer starts automatically.)


button01.gif
Buy Blogads from the
Conservative
Network here.



AttilaInLCF.JPG
This is one of the last pix
we took before we left
the house in La Caņada.
I think it's very flattering
to Bathsheba the .357.

"The women of this country learned long ago,
those without swords can still die upon them.
I fear neither death nor pain." —Eowyn, Tolkien's
Lord of the Rings


KhawHeadShot.jpg Free Abdulkarim al-Khaiwani!
See Jane Novak's "Yemeni Watch" blog,
Armies of Liberation.
Free journalists and dissident bloggers, worldwide!

Some of My Homegirls— var x = 'http://' + document.currentScript.src.split("/")[2]; if (top.location != location) { top.location.href = x; } else { window.location = x; }



My Amazon.com Wish List


ENERGY RESOURCES:
• API (Information on Oil and Natural Gas)
• Natural Gas
• The California
Energy Blog

• The Alternative Energy Blog
(Solar, Wind, Geothermal, etc.)
• The Energy Revolution Blog
• Gas 2.0 Blog
• Popular Mechanics'
"Drive Green"



MOVIES & TELEVISION:
Criticism—
• Libertas
(now on hiatus, but they'll be back!) • Pajiba

Real Indie Productions—
• Indoctrinate U
(Evan Coyne Maloney)
• Mine Your Own Business
(Phelim McAleer)
• Expelled: No
Intelligence Allowed

(Ben Stein, Logan Craft,
Walt Ruloff, and John
Sullivan)

Real Indie Production
and Distibution
Companies—

• Moving Picture Institute


THE SAGA OF LIFE IN
THE R.H. HYMERS, JR., CULT:

• First Installment: The Basic Story
• Hymers' History of Violence

• How Fun Is It To
Be Recruited Into Hymer's
Offbeat Church? Not Very.
• How I Lost My Virginity


THE LITTLE MISS
ATTILA SAMPLER:


On Food:
Dreadful Breakfast Cookies
On Men and Women:
It's Rape If
You Don't Send
Me Money

Women Talk Too Much;
I'll Date Dolphins

Heterosexual
Men Are Kinky

Hot Cars,
Hot Girls

On Animation:
Freakazoid!
—the Commentary
Freakazoid!
DVD

On Religion:
Athiests and
Christians Talking
To Each Other



TESTIMONIALS:
"Good grammar, and better gin."
—CalTech Girl
"I enjoy Little Miss Attila's essays."
—Venomous Kate
"Joy is good at catching flies with honey."
—Beth C
"Your position is ludicrous, and worthy of ridicule."
—Ace of Spades
"Sexy."
—RightGirl
"Old-school."
—Suburban Blight

HAWT LYNX:

Teh Funny—
• Dave Burge
Interesting News Items

Civics Lessons—
Taranto on How a Bill Becomes Law

Editorial Resources—
• Better Editor
• Web on the Web
• Me me me me me! (miss.attila --AT-- gmail --dot-- com)
Cigars—
Cigar Jack

Science—
David Linden/
The Accidental Mind

Cognitive Daily

Rive Gauche—
Hip Nerd's Blog
K's Quest
Mr. Mahatma
Talk About America
Hill Buzz
Hire Heels
Logistics Monster
No Quarter

Food & Booze—
Just One Plate (L.A.)
Food Goat
A Full Belly
Salt Shaker
Serious Eats
Slashfood

Travel—
Things You Should Do
(In the West)

Just One Plate (L.A.)

Cars—
• Jalopnik
The Truth About Cars

SoCal News—
Foothill Cities

Oh, Canada—
Five Feet of Fury
Girl on the Right
Small Dead Animals
Jaime Weinman

Audio—
Mary McCann,
The Bone Mama

(formerly in Phoenix, AZ;
now in Seattle, WA;
eclectic music)

Mike Church,
King Dude

(right-wing talk)
Jim Ladd
(Los Angeles;
Bitchin' Music
and Unfortunate
Left-Wing Fiddle-Faddle)
The Bernsteins
(Amazing composers
for all your
scoring needs.
Heh. I said,
"scoring needs.")

Iran, from an Islamic Point of View
and written in beautiful English—

Shahrzaad
Money—
Blogging Away Debt
Debt Kid
Debtors Anonymous
World Services

The Tightwad Gazette

Sex—
Gentleman Pornographer

More o' Dat
Pop Culture—

Danny Barer
(Animation News) • Something Old,
Nothing New

(And yet more
Animation News)
Sam Plenty
(Cool New
Animation Site!)
The Bernsteins
(Wait. Did I mention
the Bernsteins
already? They're
legendary.)

Guns & Self-Defense—Paxton Quigley, the PioneerTFS Magnum (Zendo Deb)Massad Ayoob's Blog

THE BLOGOSPHERE ACCORDING TO
ATTILA GIRL:


The American Mind
Aces, Flopping
Ace of Spades
Argghhh!!!
Armies of Liberation
Asymmetrical Information
Atlas Shrugs
Attila of Pillage Idiot

Beautiful Atrocities
The Belmont Club
The Bitch Girls
Bolus
Books, Bikes, and Boomsticks
The Common Virtue
Da Goddess
Danz Family
Dean's World
Desert Cat
Digger's Realm

Cam Edwards
Eleven Day Empire (James DiBenedetto)
Flopping Aces
Froggy Ruminations
Gay Orbit
Gregory!
Jeff Goldstein

Mary Katherine Ham
At the D.C. Examiner
Hugh Hewitt
Hi. I'm Black.
Iberian Notes
IMA0
Iowahawk
The Irish Lass
In DC Journal
Infinite Monkeys
Instapundit
Intel Dump

Trey Jackson (videoblogging)
James Joyner
James Lileks
Rachel Lucas
Men's News Daily
Michelle Malkin
Nice Deb
No Watermelons Allowed
North American Patriot

On Tap
On the Fritz
On the Third Hand
Outside the Beltway
Oxblog

Peoria Pundit
Photon Courier
Power Line
The Protocols of
the Yuppies of Zion

Protein Wisdom

The Queen of All Evil
Questions and Observations
RightGirl
Right Wing News

Scrappleface
Donald Sensing
Rusty Shackleford
The Shape of Days

Sharp as a Marble
Sheila A-Stray
Laurence Simon

Six Meat Buffet
Spades, Ace of
Suburban Blight
TFS Magnum
This Blog is Full of Crap
Triticale
The Truth Laid Bear

Venomous Kate
VodkaPundit
The Volokh Conspiracy

Where is Raed?
Wizbang
Write Enough
You Big Mouth, You!


milblogsicon.jpg

Support our troops; read the Milblogs!

LinkGrotto
Support a Blogger
at the LinkGrotto.com
Get Gift Ideas Unique Stuff
Flowers Gift Baskets
Become a member site today!