Dang, another fine post. I'm with you on the reforming the current method of legal immigration and the fact that we need more immigrants to support Social Security and Medicare. That is one possible part of the solution.

"Right now, our attitude toward immigrants—whom we need, by the way, given our system of entitlements and falling birth rates—is, "welcome to the United States. Fuck you.""

Sorry you are totally wrong here. The United States welcomes immigrants. The problem I (and lot of people have) are illegal immigrants.

There's a difference between inviting someone into your home and someone moving in without your permission.

Honestly, there is a difference between legal immigrants and illegal. Legals ones try to assimulate. They try and learn about this country. Illegal ones don't seem to. You don't wave another country's flag if you are part of a new country.

So immigrants are welcome - my grandparents come over on boats. Illegal immigrants that break the laws coming here, that bypass people waiting in line are the problem.

Nixon,Reagan, Bush 1,Bush 2.These republicans are all the same. Deny responsibility, Deny accountibility, case in point,Mr. Libby. And all you guys are going to talk about is other issues.
Allow me to predict! Bush will deny deny deny, call Libby a liar and say that it was a miscommunication.

Nicholas,

1) Would you concede that a legal immigration process that takes years and makes people jump through many hurdles unrelated to their level of security risk increases the temptation some may feel to circumvent the law?

2) Do you have anything to back up your assertion that the majority of illegal immigrants don't want to assimilate to American culture? Plenty of "illegals" speak English, for example. I realize that there are enclaves of people who only speak Spanish, but there are enclaves of people who only speak Korean as well. And Vietnamese.

3) Can you show me data that establishes huge proportions of those who participated in the protests organized by ANSWER were legitimately illegal immigrants? My impression is that a lot of young radicalized Latinos attended such rallies--students in particular. I suspect the vast, vast majority of the Latins at those rallies were legal. After all, real illegal immigrants aren't likely to go to rallies and call attention to themselves. Therefore, judging them by the actions of others who used them as a pretext for a demonstration seems rather silly.

If you have citations to back up your assertions, lay 'em on me.

"1) Would you concede that a legal immigration process that takes years and makes people jump through many hurdles unrelated to their level of security risk increases the temptation some may feel to circumvent the law?"

I do agree with this. Of course I want a million dollars too, instead of working for it, it could also be easier to steal by this example. Yes, I agree people want to come to America and some are willing to risk anything for a better life. Yes, the system needs to be overhauled. Agreed.
But because the system is broken do you "go around it" as millions of people have done? I will always had a hard time giving these people amensty ahead of the people working hard to come to the country the right way.

"2) Do you have anything to back up your assertion that the majority of illegal immigrants don't want to assimilate to American culture? Plenty of "illegals" speak English, for example. I realize that there are enclaves of people who only speak Spanish, but there are enclaves of people who only speak Korean as well. And Vietnamese."
Agreed- there are people that only speak Korean, Vietnamese, Polish and other languages. I could ask you to define "plenty". I lived outside of Philadelphia for 20 years (growing up). People spoke other languages but still spoke enough english to get by. I know live in Houston TX where alot of signs are in Spanish. In fact, in some spots English isn't even available. The name of the soccer team was changed because from 1836 (the year Houston was founded) because it offended Mexican people. The story in the Alamo is being changed in schools. They celebrate Cino Di Milo (Mexican independence day) here. Does Mexico celebrate the 4th of July? If I moved to France, would I expect everyone to speak English to me? Would I expect them to celebrate my holidays for America? No. I would learn their language and culture.

Why do phones ask you if you speak Spanish now? Why is Spanish on most menus? Koren isn't ,Chinese isn't (expect in some areas). Why are there Spanish TV stations? Why are driver liscense tests given in Spanish?

If you want to assimulate, you learn that countries ways. That's what the term assimulate means. Alot of people are not trying be it from fear of being deported, to wanting to reclaim for Mexico, to just not caring.

Can we at least agree that to do well in American you need to speak English?

"3) Can you show me data that establishes huge proportions of those who participated in the protests organized by ANSWER were legitimately illegal immigrants? My impression is that a lot of young radicalized Latinos attended such rallies--students in particular. I suspect the vast, vast majority of the Latins at those rallies were legal. After all, real illegal immigrants aren't likely to go to rallies and call attention to themselves. Therefore, judging them by the actions of others who used them as a pretext for a demonstration seems rather silly."

Again, since I don't lie in LA I don't have numbers. View Michelle Malkin website for info there. I can tell you about what's happening in Texas cities and Houston area. Where signs about - this city belongs to Mexico, or "Europeans go home" or where the US flag is burned. Actually, I have Latino/Hispinic friends. They are distrubed by what they are seeing. They are torn by alot of what's going on. Goes back to assimulation - you don't fly another countries flag if you want to join in this country. You don't burn the US flag if you really want to be here. A student here - right or wrong - burned a Mexican flag in respond to a US flag being burned. He may be going to jail for 3 days, which the others are free.

- Did you see the racial groups out there today? Black Panthers, CAIR, Socialist republic.

- Yes Latino's are hard workers, family oriented people. They have alot of admirable qualities and no body should be viewed on a small sample size. But, the news is not showing what is actually going in in these rallies.

- There is also alot of hidden costs not talked about - stolen social security numbers (the government doesn't care if 3 people are using your SS but your credit will be destroyed) , illegal drivers, welfare costs, hospital costs (I have friends who work in the hospital that talk about people just leaving after treatment which than has to be passed on to others).

- It makes you think, when the Mexican governments gives help brochures to get into the USA. That they have armed guards on there north and south borders but help their citizens sneak in (because the estimate is that 20 billion gets send back to Mexico which is about 6 % GNP)

- Yes, there are no easy answers. Sending everyone back isn't right either. Of course, a concern that no-one is really talking about is the US is again making another slave race. People who work cheap, expect nothing and can't speak up.

Thanks for the civil discussion. Good luck at the new job.

I just don't have anything to say. Not that it matters. Eh. I've just been staying at home doing nothing, but I don't care. That's how it is.